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	<title>Comments on: Shelby vows to protect the SLS</title>
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	<description>Because sometimes the most important orbit is the Beltway...</description>
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		<title>By: Scott Rankine</title>
		<link>http://www.spacepolitics.com/2013/01/30/shelby-vows-to-protect-the-sls/#comment-406473</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Scott Rankine]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 27 Mar 2013 13:28:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.spacepolitics.com/?p=6182#comment-406473</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[This is pure nonsense and pork barrel politics at its worse. All the SLS will achieve is to burn thru billions of taxpayer dollars without ever leaving the launch pad. NASA should be focusing on advanced propulsion systems for deep space exploration and get out of the &#039;air mail&#039; business (ferry cargo and people to and from low earth orbit). Anyone with any sense of history knows that the Federal government has always played a key role in kickstarting expansion into new frontiers by supporting western expansion, railroads, aviation and space exploration then steps aside and hands the ball to private enterprise as it should.

SpaceX and other entrepreneurs will leave the SLS in the dust as they should. 

The aerospace lobbyists and political hack in Congress need to get on the right side of history and embrace change, not work to undermine it for selfish, short-sighted reasons.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This is pure nonsense and pork barrel politics at its worse. All the SLS will achieve is to burn thru billions of taxpayer dollars without ever leaving the launch pad. NASA should be focusing on advanced propulsion systems for deep space exploration and get out of the &#8216;air mail&#8217; business (ferry cargo and people to and from low earth orbit). Anyone with any sense of history knows that the Federal government has always played a key role in kickstarting expansion into new frontiers by supporting western expansion, railroads, aviation and space exploration then steps aside and hands the ball to private enterprise as it should.</p>
<p>SpaceX and other entrepreneurs will leave the SLS in the dust as they should. </p>
<p>The aerospace lobbyists and political hack in Congress need to get on the right side of history and embrace change, not work to undermine it for selfish, short-sighted reasons.</p>
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		<title>By: Coastal Ron</title>
		<link>http://www.spacepolitics.com/2013/01/30/shelby-vows-to-protect-the-sls/#comment-398962</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Coastal Ron]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 13 Feb 2013 15:41:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.spacepolitics.com/?p=6182#comment-398962</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Chris B said:

&quot;&lt;i&gt;The Iraqiâ€™s are enduring our freedom!&lt;/i&gt;&quot;

No, they are finally able to have their freedom from Bush&#039;s warrantless invasion.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Chris B said:</p>
<p>&#8220;<i>The Iraqiâ€™s are enduring our freedom!</i>&#8221;</p>
<p>No, they are finally able to have their freedom from Bush&#8217;s warrantless invasion.</p>
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		<title>By: Chris B</title>
		<link>http://www.spacepolitics.com/2013/01/30/shelby-vows-to-protect-the-sls/#comment-398937</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Chris B]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 13 Feb 2013 09:20:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.spacepolitics.com/?p=6182#comment-398937</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[DCSCA, the truth is that Musk&#039;s history is four medium launch vehicles and three reusable capsules in orbit, and two docked to ISS. He has a brand new company starting entirely from scratch from no experience, using an amount of money that the space world considers to be petty cash.

And this year he&#039;s testing a modified version of the capsule with escape motors.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>DCSCA, the truth is that Musk&#8217;s history is four medium launch vehicles and three reusable capsules in orbit, and two docked to ISS. He has a brand new company starting entirely from scratch from no experience, using an amount of money that the space world considers to be petty cash.</p>
<p>And this year he&#8217;s testing a modified version of the capsule with escape motors.</p>
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		<title>By: Chris B</title>
		<link>http://www.spacepolitics.com/2013/01/30/shelby-vows-to-protect-the-sls/#comment-398935</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Chris B]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 13 Feb 2013 08:40:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.spacepolitics.com/?p=6182#comment-398935</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[But our mission was accomplished! The Iraqi&#039;s are enduring our freedom!]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>But our mission was accomplished! The Iraqi&#8217;s are enduring our freedom!</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Coastal Ron</title>
		<link>http://www.spacepolitics.com/2013/01/30/shelby-vows-to-protect-the-sls/#comment-397880</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Coastal Ron]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 Feb 2013 22:07:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.spacepolitics.com/?p=6182#comment-397880</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Guest rambled on about:

&quot;&lt;i&gt;Assuming we are speaking about a jobs programs and keeping in the spirit of congressional intent for legacy STS and Apollo hardware and JSC/KSC/MSFC/Michoud?Stennis involvement, then Iâ€™m leaning toward ten meter solutions with SRBs and liquid hydrocarbon booster augmentation and possibly some kind of modified deep throttlable J2-XS with the idle mode landing.&lt;/i&gt;&quot;

Sometimes it just seems like you want to write something in a public forum, so you just happen to choose Space Politics, but otherwise it really doesn&#039;t matter since it&#039;s just an urge to write, not to engage in conversation or discussion.

&quot;&lt;i&gt;You can also run the center engine right up to the end of lunar terminal landing and then land horizontally using distributed hypergolics...&lt;/i&gt;&quot;

ULA proposes a similar arrangement for their proposed space and lunar transportation architecture, but theirs uses existing launchers and tooling, while you are off proposing an even larger version of an unsustainable transportation system.  I wonder which one is more doable?]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Guest rambled on about:</p>
<p>&#8220;<i>Assuming we are speaking about a jobs programs and keeping in the spirit of congressional intent for legacy STS and Apollo hardware and JSC/KSC/MSFC/Michoud?Stennis involvement, then Iâ€™m leaning toward ten meter solutions with SRBs and liquid hydrocarbon booster augmentation and possibly some kind of modified deep throttlable J2-XS with the idle mode landing.</i>&#8221;</p>
<p>Sometimes it just seems like you want to write something in a public forum, so you just happen to choose Space Politics, but otherwise it really doesn&#8217;t matter since it&#8217;s just an urge to write, not to engage in conversation or discussion.</p>
<p>&#8220;<i>You can also run the center engine right up to the end of lunar terminal landing and then land horizontally using distributed hypergolics&#8230;</i>&#8221;</p>
<p>ULA proposes a similar arrangement for their proposed space and lunar transportation architecture, but theirs uses existing launchers and tooling, while you are off proposing an even larger version of an unsustainable transportation system.  I wonder which one is more doable?</p>
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		<title>By: Guest</title>
		<link>http://www.spacepolitics.com/2013/01/30/shelby-vows-to-protect-the-sls/#comment-397862</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Guest]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 Feb 2013 20:57:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.spacepolitics.com/?p=6182#comment-397862</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Assuming we are speaking about a jobs programs and keeping in the spirit of congressional intent for legacy STS and Apollo hardware and JSC/KSC/MSFC/Michoud?Stennis involvement, then I&#039;m leaning toward ten meter solutions with SRBs and liquid hydrocarbon booster augmentation and possibly some kind of modified deep throttlable J2-XS with the idle mode landing. The problem is the attachment points preferably want to be at the intertank segment and so that is problematic for big stretched tanks with the extra fuel load. So obviously we&#039;re looking at what kind of aerodynamic loads would be invoked by switching the order of the fuel and oxidizer tanks. You can also run the center engine right up to the end of lunar terminal landing and then land horizontally using distributed hypergolics, which solves a lot of exhaust blast ejecta problems. But nobody cares because it is an unmanned kamikaze mission anyways. It&#039;s all good.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Assuming we are speaking about a jobs programs and keeping in the spirit of congressional intent for legacy STS and Apollo hardware and JSC/KSC/MSFC/Michoud?Stennis involvement, then I&#8217;m leaning toward ten meter solutions with SRBs and liquid hydrocarbon booster augmentation and possibly some kind of modified deep throttlable J2-XS with the idle mode landing. The problem is the attachment points preferably want to be at the intertank segment and so that is problematic for big stretched tanks with the extra fuel load. So obviously we&#8217;re looking at what kind of aerodynamic loads would be invoked by switching the order of the fuel and oxidizer tanks. You can also run the center engine right up to the end of lunar terminal landing and then land horizontally using distributed hypergolics, which solves a lot of exhaust blast ejecta problems. But nobody cares because it is an unmanned kamikaze mission anyways. It&#8217;s all good.</p>
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		<title>By: Coastal Ron</title>
		<link>http://www.spacepolitics.com/2013/01/30/shelby-vows-to-protect-the-sls/#comment-397741</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Coastal Ron]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 Feb 2013 15:58:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.spacepolitics.com/?p=6182#comment-397741</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Guest said:

&quot;&lt;i&gt;The proposal is on NSPIRES if you wish to review it.&lt;/i&gt;&quot;

I&#039;m not familiar with NSPIRES, but when Iooked I found a solicitation for &quot;NASA Innovative Advanced Concepts&quot; (Solicitation: NNH13ZUA001N).  Is that what you are submitting your proposal to?]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Guest said:</p>
<p>&#8220;<i>The proposal is on NSPIRES if you wish to review it.</i>&#8221;</p>
<p>I&#8217;m not familiar with NSPIRES, but when Iooked I found a solicitation for &#8220;NASA Innovative Advanced Concepts&#8221; (Solicitation: NNH13ZUA001N).  Is that what you are submitting your proposal to?</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Guest</title>
		<link>http://www.spacepolitics.com/2013/01/30/shelby-vows-to-protect-the-sls/#comment-397725</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Guest]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 Feb 2013 15:16:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.spacepolitics.com/?p=6182#comment-397725</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Right, we should just put the legacy engines in storage on Earth and never fly them. And I&#039;m crazy. That sounds a lot like DSCOVR. Thanks for that.

The proposal is on NSPIRES if you wish to review it.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Right, we should just put the legacy engines in storage on Earth and never fly them. And I&#8217;m crazy. That sounds a lot like DSCOVR. Thanks for that.</p>
<p>The proposal is on NSPIRES if you wish to review it.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Coastal Ron</title>
		<link>http://www.spacepolitics.com/2013/01/30/shelby-vows-to-protect-the-sls/#comment-397353</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Coastal Ron]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 05 Feb 2013 05:56:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.spacepolitics.com/?p=6182#comment-397353</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[George Campbell said:

&quot;&lt;i&gt;But most of all, why would you spend a billion bucks to put 70 or 400 tons into orbit?&lt;/i&gt;&quot;

That is the question.  As of now, the only new program being worked on is the Obama plan to send a crew to an asteroid in 2025, but it does not have money from Congress, so it&#039;s just initial planning only at this point.

&quot;&lt;i&gt;There is no rational economic justification.&lt;/i&gt;&quot;

Well to be fair, the goal of government spending is not necessarily because there is an economic justification.  For instance, the DoD and NPS are not funded because there is an economic justification for waging war, or for keeping forests free of development.

&quot;&lt;i&gt;And what about all the science on the $100 billion dollar space station â€“ nothing for the money that you could not have done on earth for 1/10,000th the cost.&lt;/i&gt;&quot;

I don&#039;t think you know anything about what is happening on the ISS.  Have you even looked at the &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.nasa.gov/mission_pages/station/research/experiments_category.html&quot; title=&quot;Space Station Research Experiments&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;list of experiments that have been done on the ISS, or that are planned&lt;/a&gt;?  You can&#039;t do long term zero-g experiments in a 1g environment.

For instance, scientists are just now learning how to keep humans healthy while they are in zero-g for six month periods of time, and the ISS partners are planning to test the same techniques on two astronauts that stay in space for one year.

If your goal is to learn how to live and work in space, then the only way to do that is to live and work in space.  Earth is not a substitute.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>George Campbell said:</p>
<p>&#8220;<i>But most of all, why would you spend a billion bucks to put 70 or 400 tons into orbit?</i>&#8221;</p>
<p>That is the question.  As of now, the only new program being worked on is the Obama plan to send a crew to an asteroid in 2025, but it does not have money from Congress, so it&#8217;s just initial planning only at this point.</p>
<p>&#8220;<i>There is no rational economic justification.</i>&#8221;</p>
<p>Well to be fair, the goal of government spending is not necessarily because there is an economic justification.  For instance, the DoD and NPS are not funded because there is an economic justification for waging war, or for keeping forests free of development.</p>
<p>&#8220;<i>And what about all the science on the $100 billion dollar space station â€“ nothing for the money that you could not have done on earth for 1/10,000th the cost.</i>&#8221;</p>
<p>I don&#8217;t think you know anything about what is happening on the ISS.  Have you even looked at the <a href="http://www.nasa.gov/mission_pages/station/research/experiments_category.html" title="Space Station Research Experiments" rel="nofollow">list of experiments that have been done on the ISS, or that are planned</a>?  You can&#8217;t do long term zero-g experiments in a 1g environment.</p>
<p>For instance, scientists are just now learning how to keep humans healthy while they are in zero-g for six month periods of time, and the ISS partners are planning to test the same techniques on two astronauts that stay in space for one year.</p>
<p>If your goal is to learn how to live and work in space, then the only way to do that is to live and work in space.  Earth is not a substitute.</p>
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		<title>By: George Campbell</title>
		<link>http://www.spacepolitics.com/2013/01/30/shelby-vows-to-protect-the-sls/#comment-397345</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[George Campbell]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 05 Feb 2013 04:09:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.spacepolitics.com/?p=6182#comment-397345</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[The 70 ton SLS will cost between $1.3 and $2.5 billion PER LAUNCH. It will launch ONCE PER YEAR. This is NASA&#039;s official plan. I&#039;m not seeing the value for the money. I&#039;ll bet Elon Musk could put five tons into orbit for the same cost as NASA putting up 1 ton. But he wouldn&#039;t, because there is no commercial justification for doing it. If it wasn&#039;t for the ISS (have they delivered the promised science yet?), there would be no Elon Musk. But the ISS provides no return on investment at all, either scientific or financial. So we have Musk and the Falcon going to LEO, and SLS and Orion looping around the moon with nobody on board. This isn&#039;t a space program, it&#039;s a financial catastrophe.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The 70 ton SLS will cost between $1.3 and $2.5 billion PER LAUNCH. It will launch ONCE PER YEAR. This is NASA&#8217;s official plan. I&#8217;m not seeing the value for the money. I&#8217;ll bet Elon Musk could put five tons into orbit for the same cost as NASA putting up 1 ton. But he wouldn&#8217;t, because there is no commercial justification for doing it. If it wasn&#8217;t for the ISS (have they delivered the promised science yet?), there would be no Elon Musk. But the ISS provides no return on investment at all, either scientific or financial. So we have Musk and the Falcon going to LEO, and SLS and Orion looping around the moon with nobody on board. This isn&#8217;t a space program, it&#8217;s a financial catastrophe.</p>
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