Campaign '04

Kerry space discussion group

For those interested in discussing Democratic presidential candidate John Kerry’s positions on space policy, there is a new discussion group at Yahoo called, logically enough, kerryspace devoted to the topic. The group apparently just formed and has only a handful of members and messages to date, but it may be a place to turn with any burning questions or insights about Sen. Kerry’s stands on the issues.

10 comments to Kerry space discussion group

  • Dwayne A. Day

    I am not a Kerry supporter, but I was curious, so I went and took a look at this group.

    Some of the posts are humorous. Like all campaigns, the activists think that they might actually have some influence on policy. The truth is that Kerry’s “space policy” when he decides to formulate one will be written up by seasoned space policy wonks probably from the last administration, or congressional staffers. The group also has typical chatroom problems of bad spelling, grammar, etc.

    However, I quickly realized that there may be some value to reading that group. The group members have discussed gathering all the info they can about Kerry’s position on space. So it might turn into a useful resource on that subject.

  • Mark R. Whittington

    I suspect that the poor folks in this group are setting themselves up for a great deal of heart ache, since I’m not sure that Kerry is going to have any kind of space policy aside from, “NO!”

    But, then again, even if Kerry comes up with a space policy, it may not be worth much, considering the Senator’s tendency to try to be on all sides of every issue.

  • Bill White

    As Dwayne Day has pointed out in his execllent piece on SEI at SpaceReview.com, Presidential space leadership will fail without Congressional support and institutional support. While our current President Bush is far better situated than his father (namely institutional support) *IF* space policy becomes a Democrat versus Republican issue, the Bush vision will die either sooner or later – – later being in January 2009.

    In my opinion, the death of JFK plus nostalgic and sentimental illusions concerning “Camelot” gave his Apollo vision a political staying power it would not have had if JFK had not been shot and had lost the 1964 election.

    In my opinion space advocates need to wean themselves from the “Presidential Pied Piper” model and instead work to develop broad based, bi-partisan support for any new space initiative.

    President Bush deserves an A++ for his call for humans to leave LEO and he deserves an A for calling for the retirement of the orbiter.

    However, since many crucial steps in this vision will be taken by those in political power after the 2008 elections, merely rallying around the President will not bring that vision to fulfillment.

    For better or worse, the Democrats must be courted and wooed.

  • Dwayne A. Day

    My SEI piece was not specifically intended to point out that congressional support is important, but that message is certainly in there. Anyone interested in this subject should read Spaceflight and the Myth of Presidential Leadership. I don’t totally agree with the editors on all of their points, but they make a good case.

    Although counterfactual history is dangerous at times, I think it is worth asking what would have happened if George H.W. Bush had proposed NASA’s First Lunar Outpost idea in 1989, with its $25 billion price tag, instead of SEI, with a nominal $400-541 billion price tag. I think the project still would have gotten killed in the Congress. But the debate would have been better. As it was, they wasted a lot of time and effort just to get to something more reasonable.

    Back to Kerry: I think the initial indications are that he will not be in favor of much space spending at all. Although those who view NASA as the problem might take solace in the view that he might not give NASA much money, there are no indications that he is interested in alternatives either. So the result of a Kerry presidency might be to simply let the human spaceflight program atrophy.

    But I agree that it is still too early to guess with any certainty.

  • Bill White

    Space advocates getting through to Kerry directly will be a serious uphill battle. Space “vision” just doesn’t play to the themes Kerry will likely pursue in the general election.

    However, both Florida and Louisiana will see November 2004 Senate races. Senators Graham and Nelson may be in a position to capture Kerry’s ear as well as the Senate candidate from Louisiana. Both FL and LA could be crucial for final electoral college numbers.

    To my mind, a proposal to finish ISS with a combination of shuttle C and orbiter (all within the $24 billion STS budget proposed by President Bush) would give the Democratic Senate candidates a viable long term space policy and the prospects of a long term vision based on shuttle C for cargo and CEV for crew (perhaps with a new name) and which offers job security in Florida and Louisiana.

    Unless you believe Delta IV and Atlas V will provide all the lift America needs for the next 20-30 years, an immediate transition to shuttle C for cargo, as well as CEV/OSP/whatever for crew could well allow bringing key Democrat senators on board and generate a starting point for a possible a bi-partisan consensus which hopefully will survive the next transition in power.

    Even if one believes that Delta IV and Atlas V are enough to accomplish the Bush vision or that a new cheap HLLV is just over the horizon, the politics of replacing the orbiter with a shuttle C cargo lifter does provide a possible entry point for Democratic support.

  • Dwayne A. Day

    It is worth noting that the Bush administration is apparently working on a space transportation White Paper that will address broad issues concerning this subject. Someone mentioned it on Friday at the roundtable on the Hill, although I don’t know if anybody has any idea how long this will take.

    The new space transportation policy is expected to give responsibility for new launch vehicle development to the DoD. There are some interesting aspects to such a decision:

    -who pays for man-rating the EELV’s?
    -if NASA decides an HLLV is necessary for its exploration program, does DoD oversee development of it?

  • MarK R. Whittington

    I suspect that regardless of what John Kerry thinks, there’ll be at least a few Congressional Dems in favor of the new policy, if for nothing else to preserve jobs in the district.

  • angie

    As a space program employee I am very concerned about both presidential candidates and what they plan for the future. Are they truly committed to a successful and ongoing program?

    I also feel that both candidates and all members of the House and Senate should receive and be required to read NASA Space Spinoffs before they vote on the budget. Certainly, many of them would be amazed at what “ordinary” things they use every day that came from NASA and science (cell phones, microwaves, medicine, etc. etc. etc.)

  • kirk

    I have been reading the proposed Space Based Economy information related to the recent symposium in Atlanta. It seems like a reasonable and well thought out approach to stimulate interest in and provide long term support for developing space resources. According to the authors, there is a vast amount of minerals that could be mined from asteroids in near earth orbit. And instead of returning these to earth for processing, they could be used to manufacture goods in space or on the moon. A very interesting paper to say the least.

    Has anyone else read about this? If so, what did you think?

  • Dave

    From what I can tell, doing something as drastic as mining the asteroids is a medium-range goal. Unless there is a president seriously committed to growing the US into space – i.e., not Kerry or Bush – it would have to wait until after there is some sort of commercial interest already beyond LEO. The cost, and risk, would simply be too great.

    So far the primary reason I would want to see Bush back in office would be to solidify support for SEI. If that has another four years of political momentum behind it, it would probably have the staying power needed to last until interest was re-ignited by landings.