President Barack Obama spoke for over a half-hour late Sunday morning in a campaign appearance on the campus of the Florida Institute of Technology in Melbourne. However, those expecting him to spend some time talking about space, particularly contrasting his policies with those espoused by the Romney campaign, likely came away disappointed. Obama only briefly mentioned space in his speech, in reference to the creation of new manufacturing jobs in various industries:
Here on the Space Coast, we started a new era of American exploration that is creating good jobs right here in this county. We’ve begun an ambitious new direction for NASA by laying the groundwork for 21st century spaceflight and innovation. And just last month, we witnessed an incredible achievement that speaks to the nation’s sense of wonder and our can-do spirit: the United States of America landing Curiosity on Mars. [cheers]
So this is an example of what we do when we combine our science, our research, our ability to commercialize new products, making them here in America. So this is where we’ve got a choice: we could, as the House Republican budget proposes, cut back on research and technology. Or, we can continue to be at the cutting edge, because that’s what we’ve always been about. We can spark new discoveries, launch new careers, inspire the next generation to reach for something better.
I’m glad, at least, that he did not try to take full credit for Mars Curiosity. Trying to give this administration credit for Curiosity would be like Richard Nixon taking credit for the Apollo Program.
There is nothing to take credit for on MSL, it is a bloated government program that consumed far more resources then its value will ever be.
However the words by Obama as represented here are good words, they signal a turn toward a wonderful future that the US will be solidly on the track for when Romney is annihilated much like the Confederates were in “Picketts’ (should be Lou Armistead’s ) charge. RGO
What cutting edge? The United States is still beginning and doing studies of various issues like the U.S. has been doing for the last 50 years.
The U.S. Administraation, NASA, and Congress just needs to dust-off some very good existing studies and start implenation of an active human and robotic program beyond Earth’s orbit. Then the United Stes will be on the cutting edge.
Pretty interesting. Obama acknowledges the term “Space Coast”, and then goes on to talk about how space exploration is just an example of the important things that investment in technology and science can provide to our country. Evidently, the words “Space Coast” do not, in his mind, uniquely mean “place where humans are launched on rockets”. That’s a refreshing, and somewhat daring way of referring to that strip of land, which is usually associated with helmets and suits.
As to “cutting edge”, the example he gave, of Curiosity, is profoundly that. Absolutely no one else could pull that off. The “Space Coast” had a key part in that incredible accomplishment, he’s pointing out. But it just happens not to be an example of a human launched on a rocket.
It would be funny if it wasn’t so serious. The President publishes his 2013 budget with huge, billion dollar, multi-year cuts to space science, then he shows up, on the Space Coast of all places, and tries to convince the crowd that it is in the fact the Repubs doing the cutting.
I think before the internet, a president could get away with this. Today, respected science orgs including seti.org and planetary.org are running “save our science” campaigns on their websites to protest the President’s cuts. So it becomes impossible to hide the truth.
I have no idea if Pres. Obama will win the election, but the polls are clear, Pres. Obama is not going to win the Space Coast. Now I see why.
For all intents and purposes, the Obama Administration’s space policy was put in the out box wayyyyyyy back when the President delivered his KSC speech. That’s it– it’s off his ‘to do’ list. It’s done and over. Once Constellation was shelved and shuttle’s wings clipped, nothing he could say or do could win back that sliver of the Florida vote. And any ‘hope of change’ in space policy from his team in the immediate future is futile unless external events force a reassessment. [Hello, PRC, Luna awaits!] Space is simply not a priority w/his administration, w/t 30-40 something policy wonks working the corridors of power, the contract hunters nor with Mr. Obama personally. His formulative years were the time of the Sony Walkman, not the Apollo moonwalk.
The peak of hypocrisy will come should Mr.Obama attend and speak at the late Neil Armstrong’s memorial service in Washington at the Nat’l Cathedral this Thursday– and with election politics throttling up, it’s an opportunity to play CIC he likely won’t pass by. For Armstrong’s accomplishments- and the effort preceeding Apollo and its subsequent legacy, have little meaning to Mr. Obama, personally. On the other hand, Neil’s passing may provide the voices of HSF advocacy with a rare, high profile platform enhanced by a focused media interest, if only for a day, if the President attends. Listen and look between the lines of praise for Neil to find subtle criticism or blatant objection to Mr. Obama’s indifference to space and the legacy left by Neil and his colleagues. Not in editorials, or letters, but face to face. For this most likely will be the last major gathering of the surviving leadership who made a man on the moon a reality. Neil would probably be humbled by the attention at such a location -morely likely preferring a scholarly discussion at the NASM on HSF instead- and reiterate it being highly appreciated, yet wholly undeserved. Still, he would likely welcome any discourse which focuses high level public attention and rekindles talk of human spaceflight, it’s future and any opportunity to reintroduce the Apollo legacy to fresh minds with, as he said standing on the moon, “…. a vision for the future..” .
Joe Space wrote @ September 9th, 2012 at 4:27 pm
I have no idea if Pres. Obama will win the election, but the polls are clear, Pres. Obama is not going to win the Space Coast. Now I see why.>>
Obama will not win the “space coast” because of two reasons.
First most of the “space coast” workforce is loony right wing Republicans who are upset because their technowelfare has been cut…and while they might be upset about other citizens of The Republic participating in some sort of government program….they themselves have worked the notion that their particpation in a government program is “OK” because 1) they love America or 2) America needs them to be a superpower or 3) some kind of combination of 2 and 1.
Second what they cannot grasp is through really no fault of their own the kind of “investments” that the government has made in human spaceflight over the last 40 years have for the most part failed to return any real value for the cost…and it is unlikely that the investments in top down government programs such as SLS or Orion will break that trend.
Which I find strange because in large measure in a classical “small” c and “small” l…the kind of investment that Obama’s administration ismaking in space technology through teh commercial programs is a small “c” investment..
Instead of government doing a project and hoping that there are spinoffs which make the thing worthwhile (or peddling it on other merits) the commercial crew/cargo are classic “hoover dam” or interstate highway stuff…
the problem for right wing Republicans is that the notion of “small c” stuff has been so skewed by corporate buyin to the GOP that today “small c” means corporate…and large projects like SLS/Orion send lots of money to the “chosen” corporations and we are suppose to support that even without any real serious results.
The Republican party is simply a group that has run out of ideas and instead is leaning on rhetoric and visualizations of a past that never existed to oppose policies THAT THEY ONCE WOULD HAVE SUPPORTED.
Its kind of strange. RGO
@Joe Space wrote @ September 9th, 2012 at 4:27 pm
His reelection is a holding pattern, for the alternative is nothing. SLS/Orion will press on while Dragons and Falcons will fly in circles and the ISS spirals down. Look to the Clinton Administration- that is, Hillary Clinton, for a revitalization of America’s space program. For she has a genuine interest in spaceflight.
Joe Space wrote @ September 9th, 2012 at 4:27 pm
“The President publishes his 2013 budget with huge, billion dollar, multi-year cuts to space science, then he shows up, on the Space Coast of all places, and tries to convince the crowd that it is in the fact the Repubs doing the cutting.”
I guess one explanation would be that Bush/Griffin are responsible for JWST gobbling up so much of the Planetary Sciences budget, which is why OMB had to cut other future missions. Another would be that Congress, including Republicans, are pushing NASA to spend gobs of money on a rocket no one can afford to use (including Planetary Science missions) – some of that money could be going to Planetary Sciences.
Besides, what does the Space Coast have to do with “space science”? Other than government jobs (which really aren’t affected by variable budgets), is there any industry in the Space Coast that works on “space science”?
“I have no idea if Pres. Obama will win the election, but the polls are clear, Pres. Obama is not going to win the Space Coast.”
As I recall he didn’t win it four years ago, so why would he win it now, regardless what his space policies are?
The President publishes his 2013 budget with huge, billion dollar, multi-year cuts to space science,
Let’s do some fact-checking here, OK?
The FY13 budget request for Space Science was $4911.2M. What was finally appropriated for FY12 was $5090M. In fact, what was requested in FY12 was $5016.8M. That works out to $178M if Congress just runs with the proposed numbers. If you run that difference out for the five-year runout period (that not a proposal, but a notional assessment), that comes out to what might be a total $900M cut. Yes, that’s a billion dollar cut, but it’s out of a $25B total! A “huge” cut? 3.6%? I think not. We rate this “Mostly False”.
and tries to convince the crowd that it is in the fact the Repubs doing the cutting
Not too hard, looking at the House budget numbers. Remember, it’s Congress that does the cutting. The administration just does the proposing.
By the way, the Planetary Society has little to say about the $5B NASA Space Science budget. It has a lot to say about the proposed $1B planetary science piece of it. Yes, it’s impossible to hide the truth that planetary science took a hit in the FY13 budget proposal. It’s also impossible to hide the truth that the proposed budgets for all the other NASA space sciences were bumped up.
Squint harder. Then you might not need glasses.
For those who want to watch the entire speech and judge for themselves, the campaign has posted it on YouTube at:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Op20cQXRwww
Personally … I don’t think Melbourne was really the venue for a major space policy statement. Melbourne is 40 miles away from KSC, about the same distance as it is to yesterday’s campaign venue in Kissimmee. Most of the people who work in the space program live in the north party of Brevard County, not the south end. Brevard County is 73 miles long, from north to south. It’s a big county.
And in my opinion, not many people here really care if the space program ever actually accomplishes anything. They just want a job. They liked the space program jobs because they paid well, had generous benefits, and they thought that a government job was guaranteed for life.
Obama could launch a crewed mission to Mars tomorrow for a fraction of the cost of the Apollo program, and people here would hate it because they didn’t get a whole bunch of plush jobs out of it.
Just my opinion, but I think a better venue for a space-themed event would be for Obama to come to KSC in October for the next SpaceX launch. That would be the victory rally.
The president is smart to stay away from space as much as possible. He does not want to remind people how dysfunctional and destructive his policy has been, especially for registered voters in Florida. It’s a losing issue for him.
It’s always amusing when people think success in space is measured by dollars spent.
SpaceX built the Falcon 9 for about 1/4 what it would have cost NASA. They build the Dragon for about 1/10 what it would have cost NASA.
This administration has finally cracked down on all the inefficiency and waste that have plagued NASA for decades.
Some people think it’s bad that NASA actually spends less to accomplish its goals. They think it’s more impressive to spend a lot of money while accomplishing very little.
Anyone who’s been paying attention knows that the power players in Congress, Senator Mikulski in particular, have made it clear that the JWST gets the bulk of the space sciences money for the next few years. A couple of lower priority programs got pushed back. Too bad. Civilization will survive somehow.
Mark R. Whittington wrote @ September 9th, 2012 at 6:21 pm
He does not want to remind people how dysfunctional and destructive his policy has been, especially for registered voters in Florida.>>
there is zero data to support that statement…it is probably the viewpoint you wish people would have but other then pure speculation there is nothing that makes it more then the rantings of an Obama hater.
Romney is losing both in the general and in Florida. RGO
In my opinion at this point all President Obama has to do is stand pat on the space issue and let things run their course. It’s not a real issue outside the space community anyway.
Now that the election is getting closer I’ve been paying more attention to Gov. Romney and I have to say that, for better or worse, he doesn’t look like a future President to me. I think we may be getting four more years of what we have now. I like the commercial parts but some other parts, not so much.
Mark R. Whittington wrote @ September 9th, 2012 at 6:21 pm
“He does not want to remind people how dysfunctional and destructive his policy has been, especially for registered voters in Florida.”
Constellation is dead, and the ISS lives. Sounds pretty good to me.
Stephen C. Smith wrote @ September 9th, 2012 at 5:54 pm
I don’t think Melbourne was really the venue for a major space policy statement.
Duh. You’ve had your major space policy statement from the Obama Administration– years ago at KSC. And you got Romney’s during the primary debates.
@Mark R. Whittington wrote @ September 9th, 2012 at 6:21 pm
Compared to Romney’s position (this week) , it’s a veritable moonshot.
@Stephen C. Smith wrote @ September 9th, 2012 at 7:56 pm
It’s always amusing when people think success in space is measured by replicating 1962 in 2012 for less money based on technologies previously developed decades earlier. It ain’t no giant leap for mankind– except to those who ascribe to the Magnified Importance of Diminished Vision. .Bic pens were nineteen cents a piece in the ’60s. Today, they’re ten for a buck. Yes, that’s progress alright. =eyeroll=
http://www.floridatoday.com/article/20120909/COLUMNISTS0205/309090006/Guest-column-Obama-s-space-vision?odyssey=tab|topnews|text|Opinion&nclick_check=1
this is supportive of The Presidents program, sadly its babble…mostly word salad with no croutons. The Presidents policy is NOT babble or salad without croutons, just this op ed is. Sorry Rusty. F minus RGO
http://www.floridatoday.com/article/20120830/COLUMNISTS0207/308300046/Matt-Reed-Republicans-plan-space-program-mirrors-Obama-s?nclick_check=1
“Fortunately, platforms are quickly forgotten because this egregious lack of specifics will not inspire space-voters on the I-4 Corridor,†said Dale Ketcham, director of the Spaceport Research & Technology Institute at the University of Central Florida. “The great mystery is why, on this one issue, the GOP does not readily champion the private sector, yet the president does.â€
this is entertaining to me as well…The GOP really does not like the private sector…what they like is corporations, large ones being able to suck up to the public trough and get bailed out whenever they need to, provided of course they do not have unions.
Of course whatever Willard says is vaporous. Today on MTP he made a statement which his campaign reversed in under 2 hours…and that was slow considering the thing was taped Saturday night.
Willard is floundering. RGO
Look to the Clinton Administration- that is, Hillary Clinton, for a revitalization of America’s space program. For she has a genuine interest in spaceflight.
There is little to zero evidence of that. But it’s as well-founded as most of your loony claims.
If you want some idea of the fiction that the GOP and Mike Griffin are operating under go track down Griffins speech at The 14 Avenue Trade School ie Georgia Tech….it is an amazing amount of self denial. I would post a link but it is to another blog…it is just fiction passing as fact.
Obama is up 5 at 50 percent in Rasmussen’s tracking poll. See if it holds but if it does well the first debate in October should finish it. RGO
There’s a somewhat realistic, even-handed (and therefore bleak) item in Sunday’s Washington Times on the prospects for HSF under Obama or Romney:
It doesn’t go easy on SLS and I’m tempted to suspect that it was published in anticipation of Wednesday’s SLS hearing, but confess that I don’t really see the angle there. Perhaps the leading space-policy journalist who’s quoted in the article has some insights about that?
Perhaps the leading space-policy journalist who’s quoted in the article has some insights about that?
I don’t really understand the timing myself. I know he’s been working on the piece for a while. It may be just a response to the recent discussion about the respective candidates positions on space as a result of the party platforms and the science debate.
Re: Sunday’s Washington Times
Even though the content seems about right I find the title misleading at the very least.
Anyone who knows about the VSE which was Bush’s Space Policy for NASA knows that current President Obama has a policy that very much adheres to it unlike the idiotic Constellation.
But hey! We’re “journalists”! Hell with facts. Right? How’s that for a good title for an article?
@Rand Simberg wrote @ September 10th, 2012 at 11:36 am
“There is little to zero evidence of that.”
=yawn= Except you’re wrong. As usual. Ms. Clinton has expressed a personal interest in spaceflight from time to time over the years- an interest she has held since childhood– and copped to playing a part in persuading her husband, President Clinton, to attend Glenn’s STS-95 launch. It is, in fact, your reactionary, rabid, far right (and perpetually far out) objections to Ms. Clinton’s politics which is truly, ‘loony.’ @ Rand Simberg wrote @ September 10th, 2012 at 2:13 pm “I don’t really understand the timing myself. ” No surprise there. No surprise at all.
——–
Of course, of more immediate interest will be if President Obama elects to attend the late Neil Armstrong’s memorial services in Washington. At this writing, media surrogates today have indicated he will be campaigning on Thursday. That could- and should- change.
Mr. Obama found time three years ago yestersday, September 9, 2009, to jet to Manhattan and attend public services for the late Walter Cronkite, a mere television journalist w/CBS News. It would seem equally appropriate for Mr.Obama to find time to attend a public memorial for the first human being in the whole history of everything, an American no less, to set foot on another celestial body. A fellow citizen who participated in a government financed and managed project which, as one of Mr. Obama’s predecessors said at the time, created, “.. one priceless moment, in the whole history of Man, [when] all the people on this Earth were truly one.” An event that same predecessor said was part of ‘the greatest week… since the Creation.”
.
@JimNobles wrote @ September 9th, 2012 at 9:00 pm
“In my opinion at this point all President Obama has to do is stand pat on the space issue and let things run their course. It’s not a real issue outside the space community anyway.”
Yep. It has been in the out box since his KSC speech. And it would make good political sense for him to capitalize on a space-related media event and attend Armstrong’s memorial, and let a little moondust rub off on him.
@ Joe Space wrote @ September 9th, 2012 at 4:27 pm
“I have no idea if Pres. Obama will win the election, but the polls are clear, Pres. Obama is not going to win the Space Coast. Now I see why.”
Yeah well you might have stopped at “I have no idea”.
Nice reading a post with substance though.
Now at least DCSCA is onto something. So Hillary Clinton wanted to be an astronaut and she will most likely change the course of NASA’s mission and give NASA more money – regardless of the fact that Congress decides of course. Yeah I know Reality (note the “R” since reality has beed abducted by others especially those in the far right of the GOP) is a real tough mistress to some it seems. In any case, she might attend a Dragon launch with her husband and President Obama next year. You never know right?
Or maybe, just maybe, Ms. Clinton will fund research for a development of Revivator. It actually exists! And I thought I made it up. Oh well. Anyway with the new technology we could have von Braun and Sagan together drafting a policy and technology for the next White House of John Kennedy! Thank you Revivator.
DCSCA wrote @ September 10th, 2012 at 6:47 pm
‘And it would make good political sense for him to capitalize on a space-related media event and attend Armstrong’s memorial, and let a little moondust rub off on him.’
Don’t disagree with the sentiment that he should attend but let’s face it, by the end of Apollo, there was no drive or interest in space. Been there done that, and guess what, it’s the same now. There’s next to no political capital to be gained by talking about space.
And Hilary, LOL.
Regardless of the various interpretations I see here, the truth is that neither campaign wants to get off message. The Obama campaign holds a slight edge right now, and they don’t want to change a thing. Anything said about space is a possible opening for the Romney campaign to shake up the narrative and turn the tables. The fact that they’ve said so little can only be deliberate, especially at a time when Neal Armstrong’s death could serve as a possible 2×4 of Patriotism for the GOP.
Anything the Romney campaign says right now could be ammo for the Democrats. Romney’s in a stalemate position right now, in that politically Obama’s put him in a Clinton-style position by triangulating, i.e. Obama’s emphasizing private enterprise in space and Romney can’t come out for OR against it without politically swallowing his foot. He has to tread pretty carefully.
Space can hold a huge amount of leverage for such a tiny portion of the US budget. Presidents (and candidates) whip out space to show themselves as visionaries. In Obama’s case, he’s deconstructed that tradition by deliberately putting himself in a pragmatic, non-visionary position, and defined his opponent as a non-pragmatist. Romney deliberately took the same pragmatist, no-time-for-moon-bases tack when he stomped down Gingrich in the primaries. Both camps have nothing to gain by saying anything about space.
Incidentally, now that I’ve just posted a tome, I’ll just point out that it would be nuts to mention commercial space in Florida for Obama just now. The safest thing to do is talk about something about which nobody can complain. “Hey, how about that Curiosity?” Say “Mars rover!” and you know exactly what reaction you’re gonna get before you open your mouth, and not only that, the crowd will go home happy.
@NeilShipley wrote @ September 10th, 2012 at 10:39 pm
“There’s next to no political capital to be gained by talking about space.”
Except there is- as CIC honoring a national hero and making an attempt to acknowledge the accomplishment of same and the team play involved as an example of government, industry and academia cooporating in the successful execution of a goal oriented project of scale. It’s the ‘right stuff’ and the right thing to do- fits with his overall pitch. More down-to-earth is the lack of.’political capital’ gained by delivering swooning platitides about a dead television news anchorman, regardless of his then long retired capacity to chronicle historical news events through the CBS eye. And, of course, talking of Hillary at an Armstrong memorial is a non-starter. If Mr. Obama can find time to fly up to New York and pay tribute to ‘Uncle Walter’ at Lincoln Center, he can find time to get limoed across town to Washington’s Nat’l Cathedral to say a few words about the first man to walk on the moon and the national effort to put him there. For as another of Mr. Obama’s predecessors, JFK, said way back in 1961 when the journey was first proposed, ‘…it will not be one man going to the moon. If we make this judgment affirmatively, it will be an entire nation. For all of us must work to put him there.’
If Mr. Obama can find time to fly up to New York and pay tribute to ‘Uncle Walter’ at Lincoln Center, he can find time to get limoed across town to Washington’s Nat’l Cathedral to say a few words about the first man to walk on the moon and the national effort to put him there.
I don’t believe “Uncle Walter” ever sat before Congress and told them he didn’t think much of Obama’s space policies. You can argue with Obama’s space policies, but you don’t have to fault him for not personally honoring, with his bodily presence, a man who after all represented a long retired capacity to do space exploration. His heartfelt words, as well as his order that our flag fly at half staff, clearly honored a national hero and made an fine attempt to acknowledge the accomplishment of same.
Hi Dave –
“Anything the Romney campaign says right now could be ammo for the Democrats.”
You need to add the qualifier “as long as its understood by the general public”.
From what I can make out Romney and Ryan have already given us their views on space, and it is spelled ATK.
Per Ryan’s budget, all else in launchers gets cancelled to fnd Ares 1.
According to Romney’s statement, he wants the ablity to rapidly replace on orbit defense assets, by which he means Ares 1.
I may be suffering from confirmation bias in this, but I don’t think so.
My view from the start has been and is that if DoD needed Ares 1, they should have paid for it, not NASA. As to the valildity of such a need, I have no comment, as since my stroke I have held myself away from such matters.
My guess is that it is likely that Romey or Ryan will also raise Ballistic Missile Defense as an issue before their campaign is over.
(I will note that Jupiter was hit again last night, without our knowledge beforehand, most likey by a comet fragment, despite the press reports of an asteroid strike. I don’t know how many warnings people need.)
Ms. Clinton has expressed a personal interest in spaceflight from time to time over the years- an interest she has held since childhood– and copped to playing a part in persuading her husband, President Clinton, to attend Glenn’s STS-95 launch.
My goodness. Where do we find ourselves that the flag carrier for human space flight in U.S. political circles is Hillary Clinton?! Newt? Newt? Where are ya Newt? Oh, put down the gun, Newt, and don’t worry about that smoking hole in your foot ….
I will say that should Hillary Clinton be a real flag bearer for human space flight in this country, she may be uniquely qualified to get it moving. Why? Because human space exploration beyond LEO is almost certainly going to be an international proposition and, as such, will increasingly be a State Department issue. Her expertise in international affairs and cultivation of international cooperation could be profoundly important in the development of future human space flight efforts. In that respect, she commands far more space exploration authority than either Obama or Romney.
I am reminded about that wonderful new piece by Matt Rock — “LIFE ON MARS! Rover Finds Civilization of Hillary Clinton Worshipers”. See http://pardonthepundit.com/default.aspx?ID=1301.
“The Curiosity rover found that the martians wear pantsuits as religious attire. They worship in temples with glass ceilings, which female martians tap with tiny hammers in order to give them small cracks. And each year, on the anniversary of Hillary’s 2008 concession speech, the martians endure a day of fasting and mourning.”
Of course in the 2007 GOP debate Mike Huckabee suggested that Hillary would be the first person we’d send there. He knew!
@Heinrich Monroe wrote @ September 11th, 2012 at 6:12 pm
=yawn= The $2.5 billion, gold-plated, budget busting Curiosity has been on Mars roughly six weeks, at a cost of approx., $3 million/day projected against a two-year mission plan. Accordingly, please report to the nation- and readers of this blog, the approx. $136 million worth of science returned to this deficit-riddled nation thus far. We await with interest to see how the ivory-towered, elbow-patched, faculty lounge set justifies the expense other than to say we’ve gotten some pretty exciting redsish pictures quite similar to imagery any grad student can take with a $5 digital camera on a sunny outing in Arizona.
DCSCA wrote @ September 11th, 2012 at 1:49 am
It does appear that the staffers running the two campaigns disagree with you. And Hillary has a long way to go before making it to the CIC’s position. Time will tell as to which predictions are the most accurate.
In the meantime, I’ll make one. SLS and MPCV never fly as fully fledged and utilised systems. They’ll both die before the end of the new presidential term.
please report to the nation- and readers of this blog, the approx. $136 million worth of science returned to this deficit-riddled nation thus far.
As per my post, which you’re responding to, it was clearly the martians wearing pantsuits that Curiosity found. There. Happy now? Have some caffeine to wake up, and take your pills.
You know, those Apollo astronauts got some pretty exciting pictures of grey rocks and a bluish-green ball in the black sky. I’ll bet any grad student with a $5 digital camera, a flashlight, and a beachball could have taken pictures like that at night. The re-bar and concrete towered, pocket protectored and necktied, meeting pod water-cooler set were so very excited! What science did Neil accomplish in 6-weeks to distract a distraught country from the escalation in Vietnam? Oh, thought not.
C’mon. Take the bait.
@NeilShipley wrote @ September 11th, 2012 at 8:40 pm
=yawn= 30-something staffers carry little weight in policy planning. Just in implementation of same. SLS?MPCV will press on. And will fly.
@Heinrich Monroe wrote @ September 11th, 2012 at 11:27 am
Rubbish. And as a former CBS employee who had the good fortune to meet Walter, it did not merit a presidential attendance as it sets precedent. But if you want to pitch Cronkite’s memorial- a memorial for a private sector employee BTW- did and a presidential attendance and Armstrong’s memorial- a government emoplyee and the first human being in the hostorty of everything- an American no less- does not, go for it. Should bring a lot of chuckles for you in the faculty lounge.and even bigger laughs up at West 57th St. =eyeroll=
@NeilShipley wrote @ September 11th, 2012 at 8:40 pm
=yawn= 30-something staffers carry little weight in policy planning. Just in implementation of same. SLS/’MPCV will press on. And will fly.
@Heinrich Monroe wrote @ September 11th, 2012 at 11:27 am
Rubbish. And as a former CBS employee who had the good fortune to meet Walter, it did not merit a presidential attendance as it sets precedent. But if you want to pitch Cronkite’s memorial- a memorial for a private sector employee BTW- did and a presidential attendance at Armstrong’s memorial- a government employee and the first human being in the history of everything to set foot on the moon- an American no less- does not, go for it. Should bring a lot of chuckles for you in the faculty lounge.and even bigger laughs up at West 57th St. =eyeroll=
Apologies for typos.
DCSCA wrote @ September 11th, 2012 at 10:14 pm
“And as a former CBS employee…”
Too bad you don’t recognize the significance of someone that was not only a news reader, but a news interpreter during a time in America where the only alternative to the nightly news was the local late edition newspaper or AM radio.
Armstrong was the first of a number of people that set foot on the Moon, and though he will always be known for being first, even back then he wasn’t the only one that set foot on the Moon, and he certainly didn’t do the most on the surface of the Moon.
Being first is newsworthy, and Armstrong was celebrated for his accomplishments, but America didn’t choose Armstrong – NASA did.
America did choose Walter Cronkite to come into their living rooms for 19 years to tell them what was going on, and what it meant.
Who had more impact on people’s everyday lives? Walter Cronkite.
Besides, Armstrong has already been feted by Romney and Obama – anymore attention would be viewed as political pandering.
@Coastal Ron wrote @ September 12th, 2012 at 12:44 am
Except we do. And so would= and did- Walter. Neil was the first human being in the whole history of everything to set foot on another world. A historic figure sent there at great expense by the American people certain to be remembered centuries after Cronkite is long forgotten. The guy was a print reporter by trade; following in the wake of Kaltenborn, Murrow and his boys,, etc. — a long lne of correspondents, which he very much knew, as did all the folks up at West 57th and in the trade. Rather than read in print he found himself observed and heard over radio and television. And he’d almost certainly advocate attendance by Mr. Obama at Armstrong’s services in Washington over his own in Lincoln Center. =eyeroll= You weak knowledge of media matters is noted- again. The competitive ‘Iron pants’ had a lot of stiff competition, chiefly from NBC, in his time for a large part of his career in the ’60s. Taking the time to pay respects to the first man on the moon for the last time- an individual representing a massive American effort- is as much an obligation for the CIC as it was for Reagan visiting Normandy and delivering prose at Point du Hoc. =eyeroll= Walter would urge Obama to make the trip ‘cross town. Not just for the honor- but to make news.
“… anymore attention would be viewed as political pandering.” Nonsense. Performing an executive function at a one-of-a-kind national memorial service is a matter of elegance and respect. You’re just crankin’ to crank.
But if you want to pitch Cronkite’s memorial- a memorial for a private sector employee BTW
At the time of their deaths, nether Cronkite nor Armstrong was a federal employee. In fact, Armstrong was very much a public sector employee. Had he been a civil service employee, he would never have sat before a Congressional committee and criticized the space policy of his CiC.
The “first human being in the history of everything”, eh? That’s a tough act to follow. Though I guess Buzz did pretty well as the second human being in the history of everything a few minutes later, and Harrison Schmitt was #12 in the history of everything.
Certainly Obama had a choice about whether to visit the Armstrong memorial service. But what he reasoned, I think, was that it was more fitting was to bring all three of the Apollo astronauts to the White House to honor them, as he did in July 2009. Those three were, of course, representing the team that got them, and our nation, to the Moon. Without that team, Armstrong would never have been even close to the history of everything. So Obama chose to honor a team, and not the memory of one man. I find that very appropriate. Neil Armstrong would not, I’m sure, have looked at it any differently. That’s why I think he wanted to be buried at sea. At least partly because he didn’t want his gravesite to iconically represent, to the American people, the accomplishment of a team, attracting long lines of space pilgrims.
My admiration for the Apollo team is deep, and they did achieve important firsts. They showed what amazing things teamwork could accomplish, and they proudly displayed the technological prowess of our nation. They asserted soft power in a compelling and memorable way. Neil Armstrong didn’t lead that team, but had the profound honor to represent it, and the country that organized it, by implanting his boot prints on the Moon. Being fiercely judgmental about the decision of a president not to walk gravely around the coffin of a representative of that team doesn’t do service to the memory of that team.
bigger laughs up at West 57th St.
I can’t really parse the sentence that you’re referring to in this, but the bar at the Hilton can be a pretty convivial place.
DCSCA wrote @ September 12th, 2012 at 6:06 am
“Neil was the first human being in the whole history of everything to set foot on another world.”
Sure. He’s joined the long list of people that because they were first at something, and now they have become footnotes in history books. But generations of Americans didn’t have a connection to him.
At the time of Cronkites death he had still been in the public view, so there was still a strong connection to the person that had been the face of the news for a whole generation.
And if you’ll remember you Apollo history, it was because of the LEM design that Armstrong went out first – it could easily have been Aldrin if some engineers had decided to put the egress hatch on the other side of the LEM. Armstrong didn’t design Apollo, didn’t pay for it, didn’t lead the program – he was chosen for a skill-set he had – for being the most likely to survive.
Right or wrong, those that are in front of the public are missed more than those that are only briefly in the public. That’s human nature, and Cronkite was in front of the public for a very long time, as well as being trusted for what he said.
Get over it.
“You’re just crankin’ to crank.”
At least in this post you are being consistent on one view you have espoused over time, but most of the time you are just disagreeing to disagree – one time you’re for something, the next against. In that respect you’re kind of like Romney…
@Coastal Ron wrote @ September 12th, 2012 at 5:36 pm
ROFLMAO you’re just crankin’ to crank. Ask anybody under 40 about Cronkite, and they’ll shrug. He left- or rather was pushed– out of his gig over 31 yeasr ago. “And if you’ll remember you Apollo history, it was because of the LEM design that Armstrong went out first – it could easily have been Aldrin”… ROFLMAO and if you KNEW your Apollo history, you’d know Amrstrong was selected to be first, per Kraft’s memoirs. You’re hilarious. Crankin’ to crank, as ever.
Heinrich Monroe wrote @ September 12th, 2012 at 9:54 am
We await your report on the $140-plus million worth of science delivered to date by the gold plated, over budget $2.5 billion turtle known as Curiosity. Please share your faclulty-lounge data wit the people paying the freight.
We await your report
Bait taken! Rod is bent, straining the reel! It’s a whopper! Get the net! Yep, we’re sure cranking! But eh, not much of a fighter. Just repeating stuff and swimming in circles. Lots of hook marks from previous snags. A fear of faculty lounges makes one wonder about past schooling. Sorry, couldn’t resist.
As everyone knows, right now Curiosity isn’t acting as a science mission at all. It’s all about soft power, demonstrating technological superiority. Making Americans feel really, really good about themselves. Better than human space flight has made them feel in a long time. Cheers, high fives, and intense pride. We’re damned good. $140M? (Oh, that’s about two people worth of Soyuz, isn’t it?) Natch. Their seven minutes of terror really aren’t that inspiring. When was the last time you saw a crowd in Times Square cheering for Soyuz?
By the way, Curiosity isn’t gold plated. The coating on the chassis was actually chosen to best show adhering martian dust. But, you knew that …
DCSCA wrote @ September 11th, 2012 at 1:49 am
@NeilShipley wrote @ September 10th, 2012 at 10:39 pm
“There’s next to no political capital to be gained by talking about space.â€
‘Except there is-‘
Well if there is, why isn’t it being talked about? Come on, where’s your evidence?
I think this one’s run it’s course. Nothing more to say or discuss.
@NeilShipley wrote @ September 12th, 2012 at 9:16 pm
You have it backwards. Which is the nature of NewSpacers enthralled w/t Magnified Impoertance of Diminished Vision. But if you want to propose there’s no political capital to be gained by an incumbant to wax positively on the future of American space activities moving, as his campaign slogans, ‘forward’ into the 21st century, go for it. but then, there’a always the unexpected turn of external events to divert attention. Still wxpect some good MSM reportage, live web streaming and full coverage on CSPAN. =eyeroll=
@Heinrich Monroe wrote @ September 12th, 2012 at 9:07 pm
Again, we await a report on the $145 million worth of science returned by the gold-plated, $2.5 billion turtle known as Curiosity. Tick-tock, tick-tock. More pretty red pictures akin to any a grad studen w/a $5 digital camera couls snap at dawn in Arizona or California’s Mojave. Desert. C’mon, the faculty lounge set can’t be bored by its toy already… could it. The meter’s running. And the public who pays the freight is waiting.
I think this one’s run it’s course. Nothing more to say or discuss.
Except for the fish who keep swimming in circles!